November 6th, 2007
Primary Fermentation
Posted by
John in
Beginner
So I have been reading my How To Brew book and I came to John Palmer’s suggestion about primary fermentation duration.
He states that primary fermentation should always last 2 weeks. When I first started brewing, I never left a beer fermenting longer than a week.
Every recipe I followed always gave a week for fermentation and instructed you to bottle after that.
Anyone else in my boat? Leave a comment and let’s talk up how long primary fermentation should take.
Check out our post on secondary fermentation as well.
on November 6th, 2007 at 3:04 pm
I’ve seen some materials that recommend 3 days, some that says 7, some that says 10 to 14…
I personally leave it alone for the first two weeks and then take a reading. If I need to do aging I’ll transfer it all into a 5 gallon secondary, or I’ll keg it up.
But, anything less then 7 days seems to leave too much sugar in solution and gives me bottle bombs, or gives me off flavors that usually improve with some additional time in the bottle or keg. Waiting two weeks seems to take care of a lot of this for me.
on November 6th, 2007 at 6:23 pm
I think the prevailing wisdom has changed relatively recently. It was believed that primary fermentation should last not much longer than a week because of yeast autolysis.
Autolysis apparently isn’t a real threat as Palmer and Jamil Z recommend primary fermentations of two weeks up to a month and now Secondaries are generally thought of as a bad thing.
Apparently moving beer to a secondary after a week, really cuts short their cycle. During the extra time they are able to do a lot of work cleaning up the beer.
This all sounds great to me, as it’s easier and the risk of contamination is lower.
on November 7th, 2007 at 9:24 am
Thank Chris and Dave for posting your thoughts.
Question: If the notion is that process of creating a secondary fermentation is a bad thang, would you still do one if you were going to add some ingredients for flavor, like fruit or spices? Recipes generally instruct to introduce these additives in the secondary fermentation stage. If you didn’t create a secondary fermentation stage, would you add these ingredients towards the end of the primary fermentation stage?
on November 7th, 2007 at 10:39 am
First of all… I’m definitely a newbie, so don’t take my word for it.
Some of those extras can be added right to the keg. If you’re not kegging sometimes they can go right in the bottling bucket. You can even dry hop right to the keg.
But… I think everyone would say, there are times that racking to a secondary makes sense. Lots of fruit, maybe high gravity, I’m sure there are some other good scenarios. What I was saying is, a lot of times it’s not neccesary and it’s my understanding that when you do do it, you want to do it after a couple of weeks to allow the yeast to do their thing. When you rack to a secondary, you’re losing a lot of yeast. So, I would say if there is a situation to that you want to do a secondary. Give it a couple of weeks in the primary first.
on November 7th, 2007 at 12:02 pm
When I first started brewing I would only primary ferment for 1 week. I found that after a few week s in the bottle I would get overcarbed beer. Obviously the beer was not fully attenuated. I then decided to start fermenting at least 2 weeks and sometime 3-4 weeks for bigger beers and definitely 4+ weeks for lagers.
As far as a secondary I have done it mostly when adding flavor or dry hopping, but I see no reason why this could not be done in the primary after the majority of fermentation is complete.
on November 7th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
Hi Dave,
That’s what I was thinking. Only do a secondary fermentation if the beer absolutely needs it. If you are going to do something different like add ingredients to modify flavor, then do a secondary fermentation and just be really careful because you are opening up the chance for contamination.
Hi Todd,
I think that I would opt not to add flavor ingredients into the primary fermentation vessel. If I am going to open up the primary fermentation vessel to the elements to add something, I might as well get the beer off the yeast cake.
The only way to figure this out is to experiment. Use both methods and compare results.
on November 9th, 2007 at 10:12 am
Experimentation is what homebrewing is all about. Learning to make something better is a crucial part of that.
I have generally always fermented my beers for two weeks in primary. Mainly out of laziness actually. Then I rack to a keg to condition cold and carbonate. I find a lot of merit in the idea of fermenting two weeks, based on what many have already stated regarding letting yeast go through their entire life cycle. At least two weeks gets you there for sure in most cases.
Autolysis I think is another one of those held over homebrewing concerns from years past when most people used dried yeasts that were several years old. The yeast we have these days is in much better health that it ever was in the early days of brewing. My best evidence for autolysis not being a problem came last winter. I brewed a batch of IPA and Porter. I brewed them up and never got back to them for 4 months!!!! When I finally kegged them carbed them and tasted them they were still good beers depsite sitting on the yeast cakes for so long. They were stored cold (winter garage temps) so that likely helped, but there was no autolysis flavors to note or be concerned with. Healthy great yeast can get through their whole life cycle and then go perfectly dormant in the right conidtions.
Secondary fermentation has always been a misnomer. There is rarely any fermentation going on there. It should really be considered, IMO, as a conditioning step. I only employ a “secondary” when I hav a high gravity beer that I know isn’t done fermenting, but I want it off the bulk of the yeast cake. In that case it really isn’t a second ferment, just a continuation of the first. The other time I do secondary is when I want to add fruit or spices. I don’t do that in the keg normally, because its hard to get beer out of a get with fruit in there too.
on November 9th, 2007 at 8:49 pm
[…] boil, bring wort to 70 degrees and pitch yeast. At the end of fermentation (probably two weeks ), add spruce essence. Bottle or keg your […]
on February 6th, 2008 at 6:11 pm
Thanks guys for this discussion. I have just finished brewing my first IPA, was wondering about timing for 1st & 2nd fermentation. Now you guys have answered some of my questions.
on February 7th, 2008 at 9:00 am
Glad we could help with your primary fermentation questions. Let us know if you have any more.
on February 12th, 2008 at 12:04 am
That depends on your style. English brewing books almost always recommend changing over to a second fermentor after you reach 1/2 way to your FG. In most cases, for english style ale, thats about 3-4 days. It helps clear up the ale in the end (drop bright) and it also helps the flavor to get it off the trub. A secondary fermentor (or dropping) goes until its basically almost stopped bubbling or approached your final gravity. Then you need to mature (IE cask condition) the ale for another 3 weeks. That final step seriously makes the ale. Bottling just doesnt cut it when you have had dry hopped cask ale.
It’s interesting how the Brits scream to do it this way, and only this way, yet we tell people in this country to leave their ale in the primary for 14 days or more! My ale has always ended up outsanding using the brit methods and i really cant see leaving it on the yeast for that long, in primary.
But once again, it depends on your style.
on February 20th, 2008 at 9:21 pm
Maybe this is an opportunity for an experiment. We can brew an English Pale Ale, split the wort into two different fermentors, and follow two different fermentation schedules.
If we do that, we can share the results.
on March 11th, 2008 at 7:13 am
[…] out our post on primary fermentation as […]
on March 11th, 2008 at 10:50 pm
Great updates all, thanks for the input.
I’m a new brewer. On my fourth batch at the moment, ended other beers WAY too early in the past (had a porter I bottled after 1 week with dry malt and corn sugar as a primer…. literal bombs and foam. I would have liked to have seen what Mentos could’ve done there.)
Anyway, I am working on an IPA right now. Have made a few faults on it so far, pitched the yeast in a rush at a wayyy too high temperature, didn’t sterilize the oak chips well… etc. So, despite the costs, I’ve considered this another experimental beer to see what factors I can control and see what flavours I get with and without faults.
I let my primary fermentation go for over a week in a primary container and have just switched it into a glass carboy for the thought that I would be doing myself a favour in avoiding yeast autolysis and allowing the yeast to settle. After reading everything that everyone has had to say, I think I’ve made a mistake now in doing that.
Any serious ramifications? I don’t worry much about contamination… I’m quite cleanly and haven’t had many problems before. I think the main thing is that I realize now that the beer was nowhere near calming down fermentation and that it’s now going to continue for a while.
Is it fine to stay in the carboy (out of light, obviously) indefinitely? Should I stop fiddling around with it like a petulant child faffing with Christmas presents under the tree?
Ah beer, a culture long repressed by the mass producers is returning to the people!
It’s a good cultivation, thanks all for the involvement and the effort.
Cheers.
on March 12th, 2008 at 3:10 pm
Jordan,
Yes, stop fiddling. Leave it in your carboy for another week to 10 days. You should be ok.
I think the reason why the experts say to skip the secondary is to limit your chances of contamination.
on April 2nd, 2008 at 8:01 pm
I’ve had one in the primary for 3 weeks now, and it’s still bubbling. The OG was 1.072 and today it read 1.020, I’ll check it again in a few days. I am seriously thinking about skipping the secondary on this one, but I am undecided right now. You’d think a month in the primary would be enough, but who knows…
on April 16th, 2008 at 10:40 am
Primary Fermentation | Brew Dudes…
Post that opens up the discussion of how long primary fermentation should last. The newest conventional wisdom is 2 weeks. See what other brewers say in the comments….
on April 16th, 2008 at 10:58 am
I think it largely depends on the situation.
What yeast are you using? English Ale = shorter time, Brett = months or years of conditioning/fermenting..probably not primary though.
Is this a high gravity beer?
What is the fermentation temp? Cooler = Slower
I usually let stuff sit, because, I can’t get around to it. On the other hand I’ve made a couple English Ales from wort to keg in a little over a week due to party deadlines.
on April 25th, 2008 at 4:22 pm
Is this new conventional wisdom of 2 weeks standard for all styles? I have a Witbier in the carboy, Saturday will make the end of week 1, and I really don’t have the time to bottle on Sat… Thinking about letting it sit until Monday (I have the day off) what say you?
on April 27th, 2008 at 8:59 am
Byron:
Relax. Have a homebrew.
3 days is certainly not going to kill it.
on April 27th, 2008 at 9:35 am
Hi Bryon,
For your particular situation, I think you will be ok if you let it sit an extra day or two.
Two weeks is just a guideline. I created this post because the two week guideline went against my own conventional wisdom of primary fermentation only taking a week for ales.
I left my APA in the primary for two weeks…and it came out well. Mike’s opinion is that it’s the best beer I’ve brewed to date and I agree with him.
on April 27th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
RY, I certainly will relax, but all I have in stock is my left over holiday ale, not so great for this nice Spring weather…
John, I concur, tomorrow (Monday) shall be bottling day!
I really want to get one or two of those party pigs to make life easier, until I build up to kegging though… http://www.partypig.com/ Anyone ever try those things?
on April 28th, 2008 at 5:24 pm
I am confused after reading all the different posts. I just did a red ale last night, and was told to rack to a secondary when the air lock is only doing 1 to 3 bubbles a minute. This is only my second batch. So my question is, do I need to rack to a secondary, or should I leave it in the primary for two weeks or more and then bottle.
Any help would be great.
on April 28th, 2008 at 7:07 pm
The party pig is cool, but they cost like $50 for one. You need 2 or more for a full 5 gallons. You can get a basic kegging system for about $150 and can expand it as you grow.
on April 29th, 2008 at 7:21 am
Danny,
For your red ale, I would leave it in the primary fermenter for 2 weeks and bottle.
We feel that secondary vessels should be used for high gravity beers, for lagering, and for beers that are going to have additives (fruit, dry hopping).
Unless your red ale fits into the above categories, just ferment it in the primary for two weeks and then rack it up.
on April 29th, 2008 at 1:01 pm
Thanks for your reply! My last question, is how long should I leave it bottled for?
Thanks again!
on April 29th, 2008 at 2:25 pm
For this beer, I would store the bottles out of direct light at the same temperatures that your yeast needs for optimal fermentation for another two weeks.
You can open one or two earlier, just to check on things or just to collect information about the young beer’s taste, aroma, appearance, etc. but I think the beer will be really good after two weeks of bottle conditioning.
on April 30th, 2008 at 10:46 am
Hey all,
I’ve got a friend who had done a few batches this fall, and he and I am starting again for the summer, here in two weeks.
We have a couple 5gal ball-lock kegs, we were going to use for secondary, conditioning, filtering and serving. And I just wanted to get this straight.
If we are conditioning, filtering and serving from a keg (and thus also doing a touch of force carbonation), does this sound like a good step by step (assuming clenlieness, no aration, and priming transfer kegs with CO2 to avoid oxidation):
1. Primary fermentation for 1.5-3 weeks.
2. Transfer to keg and condition/flavor for 1-2 weeks.
- - I had a thought here, should I transfer in a touch of the cake to provide yeast for the secondary? Or will there be enough yeast in the solution to continue fermentation with any priming sugars in the secondary keg?
3. Rack and filter to Tertiary keg for forced carbonation for 1 week.
4. Drop pressure and serve.
Al transfers done in a closed system. The stopper of the primary fermenter has a gas release hose, as well as a permanent liquid hose. The first transfer works by connecting the liquid transfer hose to the liquid out nipple of a sterilized and primmed keg, and charging the primary fermenter with CO2 to transfer (forced transfer, not siphon). All other transfers would occur to primed kegs (CO2 displaced Oxygen) to prevent oxidation and aeration.
Does this sound like a good plan? Or too over the top?
on May 1st, 2008 at 8:07 am
Sounds like a nice closed system set up to keep O2 exposure real low. I think your steps are sound so I’ll add only a few comments.
I routinely let my beers sit in primary for at least 2 weeks; most often it’s closer to 3 weeks. At that point I transfer right to a keg. There is always going to be plenty of yeast still in solution so I wouldn’t worry about that. You can call it a secondary fermenter, but all the sugars are gone and you aren’t going to get much more fermentation, of course unless you add priming sugars. But you say that you are going to force carbonate the beer, so I don’t quite see why you’d be adding priming sugar.
I would just transfer the beer to the keg after primary, chill it, set the pressure for your forced carbonation process. Let is carb up for a week or two and condition in the cold. Then I’d draw pint to see if the carbonation and clarity is where you want it. If its good, then push that beer over to a fresh clean keg to leave the sedimented yeast behind.
You’ll now be in that “tertiary” vessel with very little yeast and fully carbed ready to consume.
Definitely not over the top. I’d just skip the priming sugar steps. That’s what kegging is all about.
Brew ON!
on June 3rd, 2008 at 10:08 am
[…] that issue. Check out these other threads of ours regarding secondary (and primary) fermentation: Primary Fermentation Skip the Secondary Better Bottle Carboy Spices in […]
on June 9th, 2008 at 9:13 am
my yeast did not start in the primary - wart may have been too warm. Suggestions? Add more yeast?
on June 19th, 2008 at 7:25 am
If you have more yeast to add, you may want to add it.
Next time you may want to try a yeast starter
on July 2nd, 2008 at 12:49 am
I usually do ~7 days of primary (until the foam has settled), then 14-20 days in secondary before bottling or kegging. When bottling another month is needed to achive desired carbination, but is worth the wait. Give your beer some time instead of bottling after a week after boiling. This is supposed to be about taste… the mass produced domestic lagers are there if you are in a hurry. Buy some more carboys, let it age, and enjoy patience.